[Darktable-users] Camera RAW vs. in-camera JPG colors

[Matteo Gloyer]

Hello list,

recently I have been experimenting with raw NEF files from a Nikon D750 in
Darktable 1.6.
Compared to the camera rendered JPG however, at initial import the colors
seemed significantly off. In particular, the camera JPGs had fairly natural
skin tones even with indoor lighting and auto WB, whereas the same shots
imported as NEF files into Darktable had by default rather unnatural
orange-ish skin colors. Overall WB also seemed a bit off (somewhat
yellow-greenish I would say), even though WB in Darktable was set to camera
WB.
I'm by all means a beginner, so I'm probably doing something wrong, but
toying with WB, saturation, tone curves etc., I found it very hard to even
match the camera JPG color quality, let alone improve on it.
Any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong?

Thanks a lot

[jeremy rosen]

you're not doing anything wrong, it is a common reaction when you begin
working with RAW

it's all based on the assumption that camera JPG are "correct". Camera JPG
are heavily post-processed, including all sort of steps to improve
skintones.

DT gives you the RAW image. i.e the image as it really was captured by the
sensor. All those steps you need to master yourself, and it took me a
couple of month before my own images were comparable to camera JPG

this is a normal learning process...

Post by Matteo Gloyer
Hello list,
recently I have been experimenting with raw NEF files from a Nikon D750 in
Darktable 1.6.
Compared to the camera rendered JPG however, at initial import the colors
seemed significantly off. In particular, the camera JPGs had fairly natural
skin tones even with indoor lighting and auto WB, whereas the same shots
imported as NEF files into Darktable had by default rather unnatural
orange-ish skin colors. Overall WB also seemed a bit off (somewhat
yellow-greenish I would say), even though WB in Darktable was set to camera
WB.
I'm by all means a beginner, so I'm probably doing something wrong, but
toying with WB, saturation, tone curves etc., I found it very hard to even
match the camera JPG color quality, let alone improve on it.
Any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong?
Thanks a lot
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[Ger Siemerink]

And I can confirm(!) that, user of a Canon camera, regards Ger

http://www.gersiemerink.net/index.php/darktable/darktable-eos60d-profiel

Post by jeremy rosen
you're not doing anything wrong, it is a common reaction when you begin
working with RAW
it's all based on the assumption that camera JPG are "correct". Camera JPG
are heavily post-processed, including all sort of steps to improve
skintones.
DT gives you the RAW image. i.e the image as it really was captured by the
sensor. All those steps you need to master yourself, and it took me a
couple of month before my own images were comparable to camera JPG
this is a normal learning process...

Post by Matteo Gloyer
Hello list,
recently I have been experimenting with raw NEF files from a Nikon D750
in Darktable 1.6.
Compared to the camera rendered JPG however, at initial import the colors
seemed significantly off. In particular, the camera JPGs had fairly natural
skin tones even with indoor lighting and auto WB, whereas the same shots
imported as NEF files into Darktable had by default rather unnatural
orange-ish skin colors. Overall WB also seemed a bit off (somewhat
yellow-greenish I would say), even though WB in Darktable was set to camera
WB.
I'm by all means a beginner, so I'm probably doing something wrong, but
toying with WB, saturation, tone curves etc., I found it very hard to even
match the camera JPG color quality, let alone improve on it.
Any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong?
Thanks a lot
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is
your
hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly thought
leadership blogs to news, videos, case studies, tutorials and more. Take a
look and join the conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net
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[KOVÁCS István]

Simple, per-component application of RGB curves (as I presume is done
by the base curve module) affects saturation. Imagine you have a
colour with R=200, G=200, B=100. If you apply the usual S-shaped
curve, it'll push the 200 values up, the 100 value down, which will
increase brightness and saturation, too. In RawTherapee, there are
multiple ways the RGB curves can be applied:
50.87.144.65/~rt/w/index.php?title=Exposure#Curve_Mode (if the IP
changes, http://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com -> 1.3.1 Exposure Tab ->
Exposure -> 13 Curve Mode).

If I recall correctly, the recommended best practice was a Weighted
curve to darken the image (more punchy shadows) followed by a
film-mode curve for highlights.

Kofa

Post by Ger Siemerink
And I can confirm(!) that, user of a Canon camera, regards Ger
http://www.gersiemerink.net/index.php/darktable/darktable-eos60d-profiel

Post by jeremy rosen
you're not doing anything wrong, it is a common reaction when you begin
working with RAW
it's all based on the assumption that camera JPG are "correct". Camera JPG
are heavily post-processed, including all sort of steps to improve
skintones.
DT gives you the RAW image. i.e the image as it really was captured by the
sensor. All those steps you need to master yourself, and it took me a couple
of month before my own images were comparable to camera JPG
this is a normal learning process...

Post by Matteo Gloyer
Hello list,
recently I have been experimenting with raw NEF files from a Nikon D750
in Darktable 1.6.
Compared to the camera rendered JPG however, at initial import the colors
seemed significantly off. In particular, the camera JPGs had fairly natural
skin tones even with indoor lighting and auto WB, whereas the same shots
imported as NEF files into Darktable had by default rather unnatural
orange-ish skin colors. Overall WB also seemed a bit off (somewhat
yellow-greenish I would say), even though WB in Darktable was set to camera
WB.
I'm by all means a beginner, so I'm probably doing something wrong, but
toying with WB, saturation, tone curves etc., I found it very hard to even
match the camera JPG color quality, let alone improve on it.
Any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong?
Thanks a lot
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is
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look and join the conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net
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--
met vriendelijke groet / kind regards Ger
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[Stéphane Gourichon]

Hello,

I have been using darktable with various Nikon cameras (mostly D60 and
D5200 and occasionally a couple of shots of other, mostly Nikon,
cameras) and have not observed such color bias so hard to overcome.

What I noticed, however, is that the base curve module changes hues and
increases saturation significantly. Its high increase in medium-light
contrast comes at the cost of loss in shadows and highlights. Depending
on the output medium and audience, I sometimes use presets "similar
Nikon", "alternate similar Nikon", "natural", or even disable the
module. I noticed that disabling the module (and compensating by
increasing the luminosity of the display, which is not an option when
the final output is paper) provides the most natural colors.

Can you post RAW and JPEG files that illustrate the problem ? I'd like
to see what you observed.

Thanks.

Post by Matteo Gloyer
Hello list,
recently I have been experimenting with raw NEF files from a Nikon
D750 in Darktable 1.6.
Compared to the camera rendered JPG however, at initial import the
colors seemed significantly off. In particular, the camera JPGs had
fairly natural skin tones even with indoor lighting and auto WB,
whereas the same shots imported as NEF files into Darktable had by
default rather unnatural orange-ish skin colors. Overall WB also
seemed a bit off (somewhat yellow-greenish I would say), even though
WB in Darktable was set to camera WB.
I'm by all means a beginner, so I'm probably doing something wrong,
but toying with WB, saturation, tone curves etc., I found it very hard
to even match the camera JPG color quality, let alone improve on it.
Any suggestions as to what I might be doing wrong?
Thanks a lot
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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sponsored by Intel and developed in partnership with Slashdot Media, is your
hub for all things parallel software development, from weekly thought
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look and join the conversation now. http://goparallel.sourceforge.net
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